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Author Topic: Aveling & Porter  (Read 18811 times)

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Offline Sentinel S4

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #60 on: November 25, 2017, 21:10:32 »
Thin ice Blakey, very thin ice there...... Fodens were only small traction engines with a trailer body bolted on. Enough of that.

Cross heads coming on well, thanks.

An interesting point is how small the hind rolls are. Today I was looking at an engine close up and being just over the 6 foot mark I can just see over the tops. However this engine, and the one drawn, seem not only to have thicker rolling surface but those rolls can not be much more than 5 foot. Yet the front rolls, coned or not, seem to be the size that we accept as normal for a roller (just thicker).

 S4.
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Offline Blakey

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #59 on: November 25, 2017, 19:58:35 »
Fair enough Sentinel - its just we all know Foden's were the more superior steam wagon makers...  didn't want to get too bogged down with technicalities !

How are those cross heads coming on mate?

Offline Sentinel S4

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #58 on: November 25, 2017, 01:42:55 »
Please don't worry about getting into the tech details, Blakey. Many of us can handle that! Some of us thrive on that (DTT and I for certain), two of us certainly know the difference between piston and slide valve, compound and simple and certainly two of us still have close workings with steam. Never worry about details...

Sentinel S4 (subtle hint in the name there....).
A day without learning something is a day lost and my brain is hungry. Feed me please.

Offline Blakey

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #57 on: November 24, 2017, 19:36:12 »
The safety valves are "Salter Spring Balance" safety valves. The issue with these is that it is possible to "wind them down" and hence increase the pressure in the boiler / the point at which they lift - this was the cause of several boiler explosions during the early years. The standard design of Aveling Safety Valve had been developed by 1884 - these had the advantage of not being able to be adjusted in steam (you could make them "blow off" under lower pressure, but not increase the pressure) Salter Safety Valves were used on export engines (by many manufactureres, not just Avelings) due to their simplicity, however often they also had additional safety valve which was locked into position so again, couldn't be tampered with whilst in steam.

The roller with the "conical rolls" in the photo is definately a single cylinder. The last of these engines were built in the very early 1880's. The first compound Aveling was built in 1881, but they didn't go into production until 1886, by which time the "standard" design of front end of roller had been developed - parallel front rolls held in place with "forks". Compound Avelings at this period were called "overhead slide valve" engines. They are often erroneously refereed to as "Fowler type" but this is not the case, not wishing to get too technical but the difference is in the slide valves, on an Aveling they are flat (the valves sitting on a horizontal plane) whilst on a Fowler they are angled, at aprox 45 degrees.

Hope this is of interest.

Offline Sentinel S4

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #56 on: September 15, 2017, 19:30:15 »
Love these early Rollers. The thickness of the front rolls is just fantastic, a very long wheel base as well, and that massive heavy headstock. A pity none of these cone rollers has survived in original condition. I believe that there is a former cone roller rebuilt with cylindrical roll still around. I certainly have seen a bobbin steered roller in the 1990's at Sellindge. Fantastic pic. Thanks for posting .

S4.
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Offline grandarog

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #55 on: September 15, 2017, 14:17:58 »
That detailed etching answers my question what the "thingy" on the boiler by the chimney was. Bracket for a running Lamp . :)

Offline DaveTheTrain

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #54 on: September 14, 2017, 23:07:29 »
Looks like Ramsbottom (spelling from Google!) valves with the springs just aft of the chimney.

I think they are too.  And Conans lovely pic confirms it.  It also nicely dates the Rochester image which I guessed at 1880 or therabouts.

DTT

Offline howard

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #53 on: September 14, 2017, 18:44:40 »
Looks like Ramsbottom (spelling from Google!) valves with the springs just aft of the chimney.

Offline conan

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #52 on: September 14, 2017, 14:12:03 »
Here's a clear view of what appears to be the same model of roller dated 1875



From this website

https://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Aveling_and_Porter
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Offline smiffy

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #51 on: September 14, 2017, 13:45:53 »
This is the original size, but I'm not sure there is much improvement in the detail.


Offline DaveTheTrain

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #50 on: September 14, 2017, 07:27:21 »
Looks like a compound engine,would the safety valves be the vague things showing at the cylinder block end?

You are right, I think.   It does look like it might be a compound when you zoom in.  I see your point about the vague things on the end of the cylinder.  I had thought they were displacement lubricators but happy to be corrected.  I wonder if the engine has early ramsbotham (I might have the spelling incorrect) safety valves and that they are just smaller, and therefore less visible.  An interesting pic nonetheless.  Perhaps smiffy has a better scan/resolution.

Offline conan

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #49 on: September 13, 2017, 23:53:48 »
Looks like a compound engine,would the safety valves be the vague things showing at the cylinder block end?
To remain ignorant of what happened before you were born is to remain a child......Cicero

Offline DaveTheTrain

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #48 on: September 13, 2017, 15:28:20 »
That is a really early engine Smiffy. The clues are 1) external bobbin steering:  2) conical front rolls (as opposed to standard cylidrical rolls:.3) the really, really heavy headstock/forecarriage head over the top of the front roll and this is the bit I cannot fathom, I cannot see where the safety valves are located. 
DTT

Offline smiffy

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #47 on: September 13, 2017, 14:21:21 »
St Margaret's Street, Rochester c.1880:

Offline Dave Smith

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Re: Aveling & Porter
« Reply #46 on: September 10, 2017, 14:54:11 »
Thanks conan. It would appear that by " crude" they meant " not refined". i.e. " any old cheap oil you can get".

 

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