News: In 1834 a 13 metre long Iguanadon fossil was found in Queen’s Road in Maidstone
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Author Topic: Buses  (Read 52749 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline peterchall

  • Established Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3620
  • Appreciation 186
  • 25.06.1929 - 12.03.2016
Buses
« Reply #35 on: November 11, 2010, 16:17:38 »
Thanks again Megapack. It has come back to me now. The trolleys ran to Sutton Road and Loose. The bus service to Penenden Heath ran via Perryfield Street; I presumed it was a trolley service because the terminal had a turning circle.
It seems as if the history of Maidstone Corporation was nearly as complex as Hastings. Here is a pre-war Crossley Mancunian; I think they were white (or cream) and brown:
                                      

There are many pictures of Maidstone buses and trolleys in this next link, and it seems that both were brown until the trolleys were replaced, then became blue. I had completely forgotten they had Daimlers and both short and long bonnet Guy Arabs:
http://jasperstransportphotographs.fotopic.net/c1376301.html



It's no use getting old if you don't get artful

Offline Megapack162

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 88
  • Appreciation 3
Buses
« Reply #34 on: November 11, 2010, 15:19:23 »
Of course in 1974 when the Borough Council came into being, they decided that double deckers were bad and dumped them all in favour of high capacity single deckers. The independents loved it however, picking up the best part of 30 buses which were less than 10 years old, some were only 2-3 years old.

Offline peterchall

  • Established Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3620
  • Appreciation 186
  • 25.06.1929 - 12.03.2016
Buses
« Reply #33 on: November 11, 2010, 12:18:19 »
Thanks for the replies, Megapack162.
I'm going to deal with 3 different items here:
1)   Re Reply#53, it seems that Hastings buses went through a chequered history of liveries and company name.
2)   Re Reply#54, my understanding was that the DD bodies were specially designed to have top decks removed, but that may have applied to pre-war buses which were all Leyland Titans. Perhaps the ones that were difficult were wartime utility bodies that would have been standard. I'm not presuming to gainsay the M&D history, but just wondering if this gives more detail. Do you know the make of the bodies concerned?
3)   Back to Reply#53, quoting ?Maidstone Corporation's trolleys were brown and cream, their buses were pale blue and cream?. I knew I'd seen blue buses somewhere :).

I have a couple of memories of their services;
(a)   The trolleys terminated alternately at the 'Fountain' and the 'Bull' at the western end of the route, but I'm not sure about the other terminus - was it Penenden Heath, where there is still what could have been a turning circle on Sandling Road?; if so, what route did they take. I believe there was a motorbus route to Penenden Heath that went via Sandling Road and Perryfield Street.
(b)   The motorbuses were Crossleys, not a very common make and, from their appearance, I don't think the bodies were a common make either.
It's no use getting old if you don't get artful

Bobnich

  • Guest
Buses
« Reply #32 on: November 11, 2010, 11:40:43 »
Megapack,   Thanks for that.  That explains everything! My big interest is the Nottingham trolleybus system and there is a link with Kent! The first trolleys used on the Nottingham system were 10 Railless LF's with Short bodywork, built by Short Bros. of Rochester. I think they stopped production of bus bodywork shortly afterwards, so if anyone out there knows more...........................................

Offline Megapack162

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 88
  • Appreciation 3
Buses
« Reply #31 on: November 11, 2010, 09:57:22 »
Having not 'spotted a bus' since my schooldays I could not initially see myself getting involved with this thread. However old memories are being jogged and previously unanswered questions remain. So.....is it true that the original double deckers,which if memory serves were Saunders Roe,taken to the Isle of Sheppey had to be assembled on the island owing to the restrictions of the Sheppey bridge?
                                                    
                                                                                                  James

According to the M&D fleet history, buses were driven across without their top desks where possible but those that were difficult to split had to be driven across private land and the mud flats at low tide. Once delivered to the island they stayed there, all servicing was carried out locally until the low rail bridge was replaced in 1960.

Offline Megapack162

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 88
  • Appreciation 3
Buses
« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2010, 09:50:44 »
So were the pre-1935 ones red & white with 'Hastings & District' name, in which case the restoration is accurate? But from previous posts it seems that there never was a 'Hastings Tramways Co'!

Where did I get my original idea that Hastings trolleys were blue (Reply#29)? Perhaps I was thinking of Maidstone Corporation, but they were brown and white.....weren't they? And they had a mixed fleet of buses and trolleys. If I'm not careful I'll start another thread going :)

Peterchall / Bobnich:

The trolleys operated independently up until 1935 as the "Hastings and District Electric Tramways Co", their livery was maroon and cream with gold lettering on the sides. From 1935 after M&D bought out the company, they were repainted green and cream but most retained the Hastings and District name, albeit in a belt & buckle style on the front.
After 1940 the new vehicles were delivered in green and cream with "Hastings Tramways" lettering on the front and sides.

The Hastings and District name was initially resurrected in December 1980 when services operated out of Hastings, Rye and Hawkhurst were branded independently of M&D; the name being fully restored when the East Sussex operations were split into a wholly independent company albeit still uner the National Bus Company umbrella.

Maidstone Corporation's trolleys were brown and cream, their buses were pale blue and cream.

Credit for this information goes to the M&D Illustrated Fleet History (1911 - 1995) published by the M&D and East Kent Bus Club.

Bobnich

  • Guest
Buses
« Reply #29 on: November 11, 2010, 08:27:44 »
Peterchall,  Hastings and District ran buses in the livery of red and cream/white but only it, appears, from the early 80's, becoming a seperate company in 1983.  Previous to that the area seems to have been served by M & D buses as well as the trolleybuse up until 1959.  I suspect that because the Dodson has been fitted with a diesel engine( in 1960) it was painted in Hastings and District colours but the dates don't really tally do they? Very odd.   There definitely were two seperate companies, Hastings and District and Hastings Tramways Company.  I had a funny feeling that the Hastings trolleys were blue as well, but the only photos I can find are green and cream, the same as M & D, but as it was a subsidiary of M & D from early on I suppose they used the same livery with different fleet names. Thanks for the info. re. the C & D bus in preservation.

patmore

  • Guest
Buses
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2010, 04:36:02 »
Thanks for the explanation of the liveries Megapack,so it was Scout I remember in red and cream
                                                                                                                         James

Offline peterchall

  • Established Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3620
  • Appreciation 186
  • 25.06.1929 - 12.03.2016
Buses
« Reply #27 on: November 10, 2010, 20:55:59 »
Every trolley delivered after 1935 was painted in standard M&D green and cream with Hastings Tramways one the sides, ultimately replaced by the Maidstone & District scroll from 1957 until closure in 1959.

So were the pre-1935 ones red & white with 'Hastings & District' name, in which case the restoration is accurate? But from previous posts it seems that there never was a 'Hastings Tramways Co'!

Where did I get my original idea that Hastings trolleys were blue (Reply#29)? Perhaps I was thinking of Maidstone Corporation, but they were brown and white.....weren't they? And they had a mixed fleet of buses and trolleys. If I'm not careful I'll start another thread going :)
It's no use getting old if you don't get artful

Offline Megapack162

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 88
  • Appreciation 3
Buses
« Reply #26 on: November 10, 2010, 16:30:43 »
As well as Hastings Tramways, didn't M&D have another subsidiary in the Hastings area until about the 1960s, running coaches?

Peterchall/James:
Skinners (taken over in 1953) were dark blue whereas Scout (taken over in 1951) were cream and red, their liveries were retained on the vehicles absorbed until the early 60s as a goodwill measure (I'm sure that M&D retained some of the customers because of it).

M&D ordered some new coaches in the early 60s which were also painted in their old liveries, these lasted until 1969 when they reverted to standard coach livery.

Offline Megapack162

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 88
  • Appreciation 3
Buses
« Reply #25 on: November 10, 2010, 16:15:46 »
I found a poor quality photo showing a trolleybus in M&D livery, with the M&D logo, I imagine taken just before the trolleybuses were abandoned. I still think they had 'Hastings Tramways' as a logo, and 'Hastings Tramways Company' name may have been retained even after trolleys took over. I know this is not Kent, but are there any 'foreigners' from Sussex who can confirm or deny? :)
The Registration of the bus in the photo was BDY864. Does anyone know when that registration was issued?

Peterchall: I've had a look through the M&D illustrated fleet history, it contains details about the Hastings trolleys but they didn't appear to buy any new ones after a batch of 5 Sunbeam Ws in 1948, these were registered BDY816-820.
When they were absorbed by M&D in 1957, their operational fleet carried the registration numbers BDY776-820 inclusive dating from 1940 through to 1948, anything older than 1940 had been withdrawn by 1952.

Every trolley delivered after 1935 was painted in standard M&D green and cream with Hastings Tramways one the sides, ultimately replaced by the Maidstone & District scroll from 1957 until closure in 1959.

Bobnich

  • Guest
Buses
« Reply #24 on: November 10, 2010, 15:21:06 »
Re. The Hastings Trolleybus.  Interesting one that! The "Dodson" appears to have a Guy chassis and bodywork by Chritopher Dodson. The below website lists every trolleybus ever running in Britain so may be of interest. 

www.trolleybus.co.uk/tbusnet.htm

Offline peterchall

  • Established Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3620
  • Appreciation 186
  • 25.06.1929 - 12.03.2016
Buses
« Reply #23 on: November 10, 2010, 15:07:54 »
Having not 'spotted a bus' since my schooldays I could not initially see myself getting involved with this thread. However old memories are being jogged and previously unanswered questions remain. So.....is it true that the original double deckers,which if memory serves were Saunders Roe,taken to the Isle of Sheppey had to be assembled on the island owing to the restrictions of the Sheppey bridge?
                                              
                                                                                                        James
That's a feature of belonging to KHF. A casual remark jogs a memory, which raises a question, and the answer to that raises another question... time consuming but enjoyable.

Yes, the top decks of double deckers had to be taken off to get them on Sheppey. They were specially constructed so that could be done easily, rather than completely assembled on the island. I thought they were made by Short Brothers as a second string job when aircraft manufacture was in the doldrums; but Saunders-Roe also made aircraft, so perhaps one or the other of us is associating our memory with that. But Shorts definitely made bus bodies, and I think some were fitted to Tilling-Stevens chassis made at Maidstone and operated by M&D - truly a complete local affair.

Re the Hastings trolleybus: Buses are usually designated by the chassis manufacturer, Guy in this case. So why has it been called a Dodson, after the bodywork.
It's no use getting old if you don't get artful

Bobnich

  • Guest
Buses
« Reply #22 on: November 10, 2010, 15:06:00 »
Peterchall,   Re. the Hastings Trolleybuses.  The first trolleys ran in Hastings on April 1st 1928 after replacing trams. They belonged to The Hastings Tramways Company.  This company was taken over By M & D in 1935 but still ran there fleet in Hastings livery, of, I think Green and Cream, although I might be wrong about that.  The company was completely absorbed into M & D in 1957 and the trolleys were given M & D fleetnames. I have a nice photo which I will try to scan and put on the forum but I might need to ask my 12 year old daughter how to do it!! The system closed down in 1959 and at least one of the fleet, no.37 a Weymann bodied Sunbeam W, headed north to Walsall where it continued to run for another decade.  

patmore

  • Guest
Buses
« Reply #21 on: November 10, 2010, 14:06:29 »
http://www.skylineaviation.co.uk/buses/mdreg.html
          This link has pics and info of Skinners although the livery is not red and cream as I recall.
                                                                                                                              James

 

BloQcs design by Bloc
SMF 2.0.11 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines