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Author Topic: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages  (Read 29737 times)

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Offline Alastair

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #70 on: April 21, 2017, 15:17:59 »
Rheagan, I was looking through the old posts and it seems I didn't answer your question about the marriage of Richard Bailey and Fanny Horn. If I didn't and you are still interested, please let me know and I will pass on anything I can find.

With apologies and Kind Regards

AJ

Offline Alastair

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #69 on: July 30, 2012, 12:27:00 »
I follow your reasoning, cornishharbour, but I have checked and Henry is most definitely a Chair Mender - two words, not one - and not a cordwainer. Nothing to say that in the next twenty years he did not become a cordwainer. I often come across people who change occupations. When they have their first child they are a Labourer, two children later they are a Licensed Victualler.

When the occupation is given as cordwainer, it doesn't necessarily mean he had his own business. If he worked for a cordwainer doing cordwainer's work, he would have described himself as a cordwainerd. He could easily have given up mending chairs to learn the footwear trade, which was probably more lucrative.

Regards

Alastair

cornishharbour

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #68 on: July 29, 2012, 19:29:09 »
Thanks Alistair,

I just wondered whether there was a possibility that the register could have had Henry's occupation as Cordwainer rather than Chairmender.  It's a similar sort of word if you look at it and it would give a bit more credance to my thought that Henry and Rachel from Shaftsbury were the parents of Charles.

Hope that makes sense!

Offline Alastair

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #67 on: July 29, 2012, 11:34:42 »
Hello cornishharbour

Yes, I do have the records for Deal. I looked at them for the last communication and what I listed are all the Gatehouses in Deal and Walmer.
It would seem Henry & Rachel were married before they arrived here, had Charles while in North Wall and left sometime afterwards. It's possible that your Shaftesbury pair could be the same ones depending, of course on their ages but always bearing in mind that Census ages were notoriously erratic.

I do hope you find them - I know from experience how frustrating it can be.

Regards

Alastair

cornishharbour

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #66 on: July 29, 2012, 06:59:53 »
Hello Alistair and many thanks for the information.

Do you have access to the baptism registers for Deal?  The reason I ask is that I wonder whether there might be a possibility that the occupation of Henry (father of Charles 1821) could have been a Cordwainer, rather than Chair Mender.

It's rather a forlorn hope but the only Henry and Rachel Gatehouse that I could find in the 1841 Census were in Shaftesbury with Henry as a Cordwainer.  Of course, I realise there could be many other reasons that I could not find this couple in the Census but I thought it might be worth checking the occupation first.

Many thanks again.

Offline Alastair

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #65 on: July 19, 2012, 16:30:53 »
Hello, cornishharbour

I do apologise for not replying sooner but have been away for a few days and just got back yesterday. Very kind of someone to advise that I might be able to help, so I will do my best.

The GATEHOUSE, also spelt GAITHOUSE, family was very small and largely based in Walmer. They first appear in 1815 and no records appear of them after around 1840.

Baptisms at St Mary's Church, Walmer

   Baptism           Birth
  7/1/1816      1/1/1816    Henry    s/o Henry & Ann GAITHOUSE, Labourer.   Died 29/1/1816 aged 5 weeks
  3/11/1816    /10/1816    Henry    s/o Henry & Ann GAITHOUSE, Labourer

12/1/1817   29/12/1816   William   s/o William & Ann GAITHOUSE, Labourer
28/8/1819     15/8/1819   John       s/o William & Ann GAITHOUSE, Labourer

  4/11/1838                       Mary Ann GAITHOUSE d/o Judith, Single Woman

Marriages at St Mary's Church, Walmer:

  2/1/1815  William GATEHOUSE to Ann GRANT    Witnesses:  Joseph NEWTON, John NORRIS

  5/2/1816  Henry GAITHOUSE to Judith GRANT    Witnesses:  Jane SMEED, John NORRIS

Baptism at St Leonard's Church, Deal

16/12/1821  Charles GATEHOUSE  s/o Henry & Rachel, Chair Mender of North Wall

There is no marriage recorded between Henry & Judith but that could have taken place in her own parish if she was not local. I would guess that they were the parents of Judith who was the mother of Mary Ann.  It might be convenient to suppose that Henry married Rachel after the death of Ann but there is no record of Ann's burial so they must be assumed to be a separate couple.

I do hope this has been of some small help

Kind Regards

Alastair

Offline ellenkate

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #64 on: July 16, 2012, 09:17:47 »
Hello Cornishharbour-

Dover Express and Dover Telegraph are on film at Dover Ref Library;  Kentish Gazettes on film at Canterbury ref library.
Also some papers are now on the internet (by subscription)
I have indexed a lot of refs from newspapers in my East Kent indexes (published by Kent Fam History Soc)

Ellenkate
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cornishharbour

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #63 on: July 16, 2012, 08:39:19 »
Thanks Ellenkate,

I, too, have a few reports of criminal activity but later on in the 1870s and 1880s - may I ask where you found the Dover newspaper reports.

Thanks

Offline ellenkate

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #62 on: July 15, 2012, 21:54:35 »
A few GATEHOUSE  refs from my indexes:


Alfred GATEHOUSE -  (landlord of The Round Tower Inn, Tower Hamlets, Dover) –
His wife Mrs GATEHOUSE  testified regarding George JEFFREYS a lodger who was killed by chalk blasting
(Dover Express 26 Jan 1900 p.7 col.3,  continued 2 February and after) (info ex S.Lees)

Alice GATEHOUSE (daughter of William GATEHOUSE, labr)  married (on 28.Nov 1844 at Dover)  to Edward BETTS mariner (son of Richard BETTS mariner).   

Catherine GATEHOUSE, of Charlton by Dover, spr married Richard BEER ba of the same parish by Banns   28 Feb 1835 (Charlton by Dover Parish Regr)

Charles GATEHOUSE, labr  charge of assaulting Police Constable HOGBEN (3 line report).  Dover Police Case  (Dover Telegraph 14 Feb 1846 p.8 col.2 - on film Dover ref library)

E.W. GATEHOUSE  listed on “Holy Trinity Hall Memorial 1914-18”, “this hall was built in memory of the men and others connected with it who fought and fell in the Great War”  “Whosoeth loseth his life shall save it”   (this list is in the Book of Remembrance kept in Dover St Marys church.  Note: this Holy Trinity Hall  was demolished to make way for the A20 trunk road extension)

Fred GATEHOUSE – war death  (Dover Express 11.12.1914 p.4 col.6)  On film at Dover Ref Library

Henry GATEHOUSE (x) ba married Eliza WOOD spr (x)  both of Alkham.  At Alkham 24 Oct 1836   (Alkham records)

Henry GATEHOUSE  lodger married  63  marine stores dealer  born Walmer  (1881 Census, Enum.Dist 4  RG11/1009, page 12 (folio 9) “Bricklayers Arms” Fenchurch Street, FOLKESTONE)

John GATEHOUSE aged 13, along with John LEE (13) and Sidney MARTIN (11) accused of breaking glass windows at Christ Church School  (Dover Express 9 Feb 1900 p.7 col 5)  (info ex S.Lees)

Judith Ann GATEHOUSE of Buckland by Dover, widow -  accused William CHANDLER (with whom she formerly lived) of assault.  He was sentenced to 3 months imp.  (Dover Telegraph 21 Jul 1838 p.1 col.4)

Thomas GATEHOUSE – police court – charged with stealing turnips, property of C.B.GORELY (9 line report)   (Dover Telegraph 7 Feb 1846 p.8 col.3)

W.J.GATEHOUSE   on list of those who lost their lives in the Trawler & Minesweeping Patrol, Dover, 1914-19
“Greater love hath no man than this”  (list included in Book of Remembrance kept in Dover St Marys Church_

William GATEHOUSE committed for trial on charge of stealing 2 sacks of barley (a long report)  (Dover Telegraph 15 May 1847 p.8 col.3)

William GATEHOUSE  - charged with being drunk and disorderly in Last Lane, Dover  (Dover Police Court)  (Dover Express Oct 29 1886)

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cornishharbour

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #61 on: July 15, 2012, 20:00:36 »
Hello Alistair,

I am new to this site but have been advised that you may be able to help me.

I am trying to trace any references to the Gatehouse family from the Deal/Walmer area.  Census records for Charles (aka Richard) Gatehouse suggest he was born in Walmer or Deal in c 1818-1822.

Marriage certificate for Charles in 1850 gives his father's name as Henry.  I found one baptism on IGI for Charles of Henry and Rachel in Deal, 1821 but no other references to the family.  Haven't found Charles in the 1841 Census but thereafter he was living in the Dover area.

If it's not too much trouble I'd be really grateful if you could checks the records you have access to, to see if there is any further reference to any Gatehouse siblings or even a marriage of the parents.

Thank you, Sally

Offline kyn

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #60 on: July 01, 2012, 17:08:06 »
Please use forum names in posts....

Offline Alastair

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #59 on: June 30, 2012, 14:59:37 »
Hello Rheagan,

Roger and Mary Stevens sounds hopeful if they named their children Francis & Susanna. If these names don't appear anywhere else I would be pretty confident. Naming children after parents and grandparents was extremely common, almost to the point of being an unwritten law, so it does help the genealogist.

Kind regards

Alastair

Rheagan

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #58 on: June 30, 2012, 02:37:23 »
Hello Alastair,

Thank you for taking the time reply!  Your ideas and suggestions have been helpful.  I already knew that Roger Bayley and Mary Stevens were the couple relevant to my research, I was just at a loss as to how to determine which Roger of the two was the one who married Mary Stevens, Roger, son of Roger and Elizabeth, or Roger, son of Francis and Susanna.  Incidentaly, Roger Bayley and Mary Stevens named one of their sons Francis and one of their daughters Susanna.  Since these names don't show up anywhere else in the family, combined with your suggestions of referring to the names of the couple's children, I am willing to confidently infer, for the time being, that Roger, son of Francis and Susanna, was the Roger who married Mary Stevens.  Thank you very much for your time and suggestions.  It was quite helpful!

Sincerely,
Elizabeth

Offline Alastair

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #57 on: June 29, 2012, 15:36:54 »
Hello, Elizabeth,

St Lawrence is nowhere near my field of study as it's in Ramsgate. It's always tricky with two people with the same name at a period when very little information was recorded on marriage records, such as parents.  I have come across this and found that the nearest way to decide who were the right set of parents was by the childrens' names. Not accurate, by any means but with no more information, there's no choice. If the children had similar names as one of the couples, the likelihood is that that was the right set of parents.

Similarly, did the children in your line have Stevens or Gass as a middle name? It was very usual to use the mother's maiden name as a second name.   

Further than that, I'm afraid I can be of no more help.
 
With apologies

Alastair

Rheagan

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Re: Parish Records of Deal and Nearby Villages
« Reply #56 on: June 28, 2012, 20:57:21 »
Hello again Alastair,

I have a new question for you!  If this is too far from Deal, feel free to let me know :)  It concerns the family of the Richard Bayley who married Fanny Horn whom I had asked you about in my last post.  I know from Richard's christening record that his parents were Roger and Mary Bayley.  I know Roger Bayley married Mary Stevens in 1790 in St. Lawrence.  The problem I have is that there were two Roger Bayleys born in St. Lawrence between 1760 and 1770, one in 1762 to Francis and Susanna Bayley and the other in 1763 to Roger and Elizabeth Bayley.  I believe one of these is the Roger who married Mary Stevens and the other married Sarah Gass in 1785 with both marriages taking place in St. Lawrence.  Would you know how I might go about differentiating between the two Rogers to know which one was the one who married Mary Stevens?  Any help or suggestions would be very much appreciated!

Sincerely,
Elizabeth

 

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